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FAQs on Growth |
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Co-Pastor Josiah Bancroft answers frequently asked questions concerning future plans at Grace -- the multi-congregational model and renovation to the current facility. Please visit our blogsite for current information and to join in on the ongoing conversation. A: Great question. With the brief meeting we had recently on there were so many things that we couldn’t engage because of time. Even some crucial things like how the new model and direction flows from our values weren’t adequately addressed. Of course any growth at Grace should reflect our values and who we are as a community. The seven values we list in the bulletin are ways we see God’s grace shaping us uniquely as a community. Our model extends those into new sites and congregations, so it fits us by maintaining our unique and central values in new places. But looking at the individual values, perhaps interdependence or pursuing mutually dependent relationships is the core value we have struggled most with practically. Our problems with communication, organization and access to relationships are faces of our failure to be as interdependent as God would have us be. I am not saying Grace does none of these things, but even as we celebrate the good in our church, we need to be honest about our need to grow. (Another value we have!) And, speaking honestly, our struggle with interdependence shows up when folks can’t connect relationally. The staff and pastors perpetual attempts at better organization reflect some level of failure of interdependence. A newcomer’s difficulty finding a way to serve and staff’s frustration with a lack of volunteers can also be traced back to our needing to believe and apply this key value of interdependence in creative, biblical and practical ways of working together. These same issues show up in our church planting -- our efforts to grow new congregations. We want our growth into the communities around us to extend and continue our relationships and connections. And Grace Biltmore is part of that extension of Grace, but some of our problems with interdependence show up even in that good relationship. But we haven’t made the practical structures or ways of working together that supported the level of interdependence to reflect that relational value. Looking at the whole problem the Session and Pastors over the last months have made several large steps that are working out through the staff and church currently:
With this new model, we are now pursuing the way to extend Grace in new ‘sites’ and ‘congregations’ connected sites that share relationally committed pastors and leaders. So this new model will give our growth a practical and relational interdependence.
A: There are actually several issues here. Let’s see if I can sort though them in some order. But there really isn’t any way to avoid change, and I think that may be part of what you are getting at. I would agree there is a large cost to trying to stay the same. Trying to avoid growth or change is just another way to change. Because when members disengage from the needs around them and focus on keeping things static, the church loses the central gospel thrust that should define it as it takes the gospel into new lives in new ways. And that is a cataclysmic change. It can go unnoticed if we keep talking the same way we always have. But our audience changes. We find ourselves talking less to the needs around us as we begin speaking more to ourselves. If that were what you mean by diluting or dissolving our uniqueness, I would agree that it is always a danger and something to be appropriately feared. In our understanding of the gospel, of God’s grace to the world and to his people, we often say that the opposite of fear is faith. I think that applies here. So, we have a mandate to continue to take the gospel to new people. The question that remains is how should we best do that, given who we are and where God had brought us. As you read some of the other questions, I think you will see how we hope do that without losing leadership, connections or our central values.
A few months ago, we heard about growth in “3D” – that is, growing holistically and not just out. In what other ways is Grace dealing with the issue of growth on different levels? A: In addition to our continuing commitment to discipling, we are making good progress seeing folks start to get involved in small groups. That is a way to grow together and make relationships that will have a lasting impact. Organizationally, we have made a tangible commitment to grow and to learn to inform, motivate, recruit and train volunteer teams alongside of our staff and pastors. Dave Key is bringing expertise in organizing work and staff to us, and the progress is palpable. This new model will give us a unique approach to planting new works that can extend grace through our members into new areas and sites. The model will bear a unique stamp from Grace’s values and culture. My concern is most members will still continue to go to Mills River Grace. It's what they've done for so long, it's where they met friends, they like the pastors’ teaching there, etc, etc. Call it a 'change is bad' mindset. Is it realistic to encourage people to go elsewhere? A: Some folks will want to stay just where they are, and we don’t want them to worry. No one is sending anyone away or requiring folks to attend one place or another. That’s not who we are and I don’t think that it works very well, either. But in among those who want to stay there are also others who are more adventurous. They would love to start something new. Others would like a smaller community. And some have a heart to move grace into their local community in a new way, rather than driving all the way here. With the last plant, I think about 100 folks from Grace went out with Gus to Biltmore initially. Some returned, some stayed and new folks joined them. And I think that is what we will see in the future. I also predict that if we do a good job of recruiting, training and supporting, the other sites will do great. A smaller group with the same values sounds wonderful to many folks. And who knows, perhaps a group of friends would band together as a part of a new core.
Grace has seemed to try a number of different approaches to handling growth – deeper not wider, a third service (one in the past and the current one), the church plant with Grace Biltmore, a recent elder recommendation to build a larger campus, and now multi-congregations. I am in love with Grace, and will support it in whatever direction it chooses, but I am a little confused: why haven’t we been able to set a more firm direction? A: Grace has been struggling over the last couple of years to find the right steps forward, and that struggle may have left some uncertain of what was going on. The struggle has not been over the basics of our identity, our values or the central emphasis of the church. Our struggle has been with the practical issues of how to move ahead with the growth God has given. Answering these practical questions has pushed us to establish a long-term plan, and developing that has not been quick, easy or simple. Getting a clear vision has required staff changes, reorganizing our ministry teams, finding the right people to lead key places and thinking through how we can best keep the values and calling of the church as we go forward. I wish that things had been easier and cleaner, but through the wrestling we have heard well from God and each other. So now we are able to step ahead with a clear and compelling vision.
I thought the ‘why’ we are pursuing this direction was clearly presented at the Congregational Meeting, but the ‘nuts-and-bolts’ question of ‘how’ was not really addressed. When can we expect more specifics of how this model might pan out? A: I also thought that the ‘why’ was well addressed in the presentation, but we didn’t have the time for ‘nuts and bolts.’ We have a plan to communicate the new model that will lay out all the ways the congregation will have access to all the information over the next couple of months. Currently we are running a blog, answering frequently asked questions (FAQs). More meetings, video presentations for the small groups, mailings, focus groups, and Congregational Q&A times are planned as well. On December 10, we will shorten each of our Sunday services to allow time to answer questions you may have. We are committed to making sure that everyone who wants information has whatever they need. Perhaps this diagram would be a helpful starting place. In this model we will use the word ‘Church’ to talk about the big circle, so we continue as one church called Grace Community. But to grow -- rather than only building new buildings and growing in one place -- we will aim to have new services, sites and congregations that share some things and that have some things of their own. The language we are using is that ‘service’ will be a new meeting at an established location so ‘simply grace’ is a third service at Mills River. A site would be a new location where one of the pastors from Grace preaches. A site is a start up for a new congregation. One of the smaller circles might represent a site. A congregation is a new location that has its own pastor and leadership like a regular church. But unlike a usual church plant, the new sites and congregations will share some staff, some events, some resources and equipment with Grace Mills River and the pastors and elders will all serve on a single Session that oversees all of Grace Community Church services, sites and congregations, and there will be a shared budget as well. Doug Swaggerty from Harbor PCA in San Diego is one of the pastors at a church using this model in the PCA. Doug has been very helpful for us to help begin to sort out how some of the practical issues will work. It is always helpful to talk with someone who has been doing this successfully for years! Of course Asheville and San Diego are very different places with their own struggles and culture. They are also very different sizes. So we will have to make the changes that would allow us to keep our unique character as a church and minister in this community. But this model gives us a way to grow, to plant, to stay connected and to keep true to who we are and what gives us a unique voice in the local ‘choir of churches’ singing grace to the area.
A: No, it shouldn’t be a problem at all. Other churches like Perimeter in Atlanta, Briarwood in Birmingham, Redeemer in New York and Harbor in San Diego continued in the denomination with similar or related structures. There are churches in Saint Louis and other places that are moving in this direction as well.
For three straight years, we have ended the year with deficits approaching $100,000. Is it realistic to believe our members will pledge another million or so dollars when we can’t meet budgets? I understand how we don't want to be "arm twisters" or guilt people into things, but God speaks openly about money. Shouldn’t we explore the possibility of asking gracefully for people to help? A: Great questions and only reasonable to ask! First, let me be clear. We HAVE NOT ended any year with DEBT other than what the congregation voted to carry on this building and that we are currently working to repay. What we have done is ended without meeting BUDGET. The difference is that we didn’t repair the roof, start new ministries, add staff or increase ministry spending as we had hoped. We built the budget on what we wanted to do, but when it didn’t come in, we just did less. So, we didn’t meet budget, but we didn’t end in debt. We haven’t asked because we wanted to have a clear and compelling future-directed plan for ministry that made a case for the funding we need based on our unique work together. We have the outlines of that plan now and are adding the new layers of detail each week. Over the next few weeks we will continue to communicate that progress and plan. As we communicate and as the congregation understands and helps us perfect the plan, we will start to graciously, openly, directly, supportively ask people to make significant sacrifices in giving so we can move ahead together. Preparing for that the session has formed committees for building and finance and we have added significant volunteers and staff to help us with the project.
I appreciate the well-thought out plan. It’s an exciting thing to contemplate getting out the message and Gospel of hope through such an innovative approach. Are there examples of other churches successfully handing growth through this model? If so where I can find out information about them? A: You will find some information in the other answers, but on the web you could go to visit Harbor PCA’s website (http://www.harborpc.org) to see how other folks are doing this. And there is a lot of information in the other FAQ answers too. If I understood right, we will be developing a pastoral team to rotate between these congregations. My concern is that it is very difficult to find pastors of Dave and Josiah’s gifts and understanding of grace. Where will we find these pastors? And how will we pay them? What will be the process for mentoring? A: Another good question, and thanks for the compliment! Let me give a little more information. Maybe ‘rotation’ isn’t the best way to describe what we are planning. Sorry for that! Actually each congregation will have at least one pastor primarily responsible for that congregation. The pastor will have a local team of leaders as well. He would have about 80% of the preaching and teaching duties there. But every once in a while he would ‘rotate’ through another site or congregation. Dave and Josiah would preach at his site, perhaps. The frequency of the ‘rotation’ will be very slow. What I mean is that pastors will be in one place 80% of the time or so, but will be able to help start new sites or fill-in. Sharing preachers this way will help us all stay connected and feel part of one larger church. And you are right, finding folks who can carry preaching well here requires us to pay real attention to our recruiting and training on site here. But the folks who are showing interest are not just out of seminary. For the most part they are experienced and show good preaching and teaching gifts. They are attracted because of grace and partnership issues in this model. Most have already said they are interested in having our input into their ministry and they are welcoming of the mentoring we can offer. The outline of the mentoring has been explained in a document we are using as a part of our recruiting and explaining the relationship between the pastors that we would like to see. (If you want a copy of that, we can make it available to you. Just contact Minty at the church office.) Broad-brush strokes: Weekly meeting
Are there current sites or potential congregations we are exploring now? If so, what are we doing to develop people interested in starting a new congregation? A: There are several places we could consider. Usually church plants only look at areas of need. This model encourages us to look at places where we already have folks attending Grace who are interested in a site closer to them. We want to keep good relationships in our Presbytery, so I won’t mention possible sites until we have spoken with folks who need to know what we are doing. We appreciate our shared work and want to be supportive and helpful to the Presbytery even as we make plans for more congregations. Each new group interested in planting will be trained and supported as they start. Currently elder, staff and pastors work to develop and assess interested groups. Right now, one leadership group is going through the ‘Galatians’ study and preparing to start as a site or congregation in coming next months. We have our eye on other locations where Grace folks might want to start, but will need folks willing to pull along with us in a committed way. Starting something new is a lot of work and we have found that some struggle with committing to the effort, and that’s OK. But to start something new, we are looking for folks who have an interest and are willing to invest time, energy and money to see Grace extended in their area.
A new third service – simply grace – recently started. What role does it play in terms of the congregational model? A: As Grace Community extends into other areas with sites and services, we still need to provide opportunities for the present congregation to grow. That is why we are looking at building renovation and at more services at Mills River. We want the current site to do well and to grow as well. New services seem like the quickest and easiest way forward. Grace recently launched a daughter church, Grace Biltmore. How does the launch of Grace Biltmore compare with what we want to do with the multi-congregational model? And will there be a change in the relationship with Grace Biltmore? A: We will continue and are looking for ways to expand the ways we can work together with Gus, the leader and folks at Grace Biltmore. Recently we met with Gus and assured him of our continued support. So we are not expecting our care and support of Biltmore to do anything but continue and improve. It might also help to say that we will gladly continue to partner with other churches in the presbytery to plant churches on the old model. The current renovation plans seemed centered on the “emergency” need to expand room for Children’s Ministries. Yet it is my understanding that Children’s Ministry space is only fully used during the first service (9:30). Why can’t we make wiser use of space by expanding the ministries into the second service? A: There are some problems with that because it requires double the volunteers to handle the same number of children spread across two services. Other solutions would split families with children of different ages, which isn’t practical. The other obvious problem is that we are already in need of additional volunteers for present children’s ministries. (If you are willing to help, call for Melanie Wilkins at the church or just sign up on Sunday!) Eventually I think we will need both the extra space and the additional volunteers, but the space is needed immediately. Size of congregation is such a relative issue. We have been part of a church with over 5,000 members where we felt much more of a true sense of community than we feel now at Grace Church. We were also in a church with just over 350 members where we felt almost no sense of community. It really comes down to organization, leadership and opportunities for connection. Are we biting off a potential organizational nightmare with several churches under one overall umbrella when it was stated at the Congregational Meeting that no one on staff currently has the gifts or desire to organize and lead a church of our present size under just ONE roof? It sounds like a really difficult organizational challenge, which is exactly where Grace has always struggled. A: First, I would encourage you to get involved in some of the many ways you could serve, to join a home group or supper club, or to sign up with some of the service groups. These events and groups carry our community and relationship in a way that Sunday morning can’t. But even with that invitation, you are right that it is an area where we can grow. We want to learn how to excel in giving people ‘ways in.’ As you read some of the other FAQ answers I think you will be encouraged that we are taking a holistic, long-term and committed approach to answering this area of need. There isn’t just one thing that we are doing, but a lot of foundational changes aimed at solving this long term. Concerning organization, I would amend what you heard. We do have the leadership, ability and gifts to organize ourselves well and are in the process of doing that. By choice we will not have the same corporate feel of some ministries or churches, but that is an issue of tone and method, not organizational ability or leadership. Dave Key and others are making good steps and I am confident that organization won’t be a problem over the long haul. Whether we grow in one place, or whether we grow in multiple places, organization, communication and leadership will be essential and I believe that God has assembled a good team to take these things on with good results.
I was confused by the term ‘video venue.’ What does that mean? And what role do we see video playing in the multi-congregational model? A: We are investigating how best to use technology in support of growth. Part of that could be a video venue, meaning a location where the sermon or other parts of the service could be presented by taped video or by live feed, but where elements of the service would be live, perhaps with a host or pastor leading. Our preference is for live folks, but we want to be open to growing at Mills River or even into new places where video might be part of the start up strategy or even the permanent approach. How much is lack of space limiting what we can do at Grace? What things are NOT happening because of our space crunch? A: First, we are not growing. People leave because we can’t accommodate them organizationally or physically. We are changing the organization to accommodate more folks in better ways. We are making plans to offer other sites and congregations where folks drawn by grace can find a local home if they desire, and we are adding services. We have also extremely limited adult education space for use on Sunday morning. Our current limited space for fellowship means we have to choose between a space to mingle and meet folks and a video venue or education space. Children’s Ministries frequently has had to close the doors when classes fill up on Sunday AM. These are some of the immediate issues of space. We love Grace and finally feel like we have found a true church “home.” How can we best partner together as a Body to accomplish these plans? What are some specific ways we can get involved? A: I would suggest cloning. What wonderful questions. There are lots of ways to serve, generally and a connect card would be way to start that. But as to specifically pushing these plans forward we will need help with funding, with raising those funds in a supportive and gracious way, with communicating and hosting the events where the communication takes place, and with prayer.
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Grace Community Church • 495 Cardinal Road, Mills River, NC 28759 828 891-2006 or 828 684-0033, fax 828 891-3534 |
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